How to rebuild the 3.3

[drbandkgb]

Im planning on buying a used 3.3 from either a salvage yard or else where..

The plan..
To create more than the whimpy 170hp..

What Nissan motors have parts that cross.. Im looking for ways to create more horse power

Do I bore the Block? If so what would be the largest piston I can do.. ????

Any info or ideas?

 

[NismoFire]

Maxima, Fronty, Pathy, Hardbody all had the VG33..of course, you'll want the supercharger, so you'll want to either get one already on it, or buy one...not sure if the 350z still had the VG33 or not. I think the first gen Z did..

Definitely on the to-do list:
-Cams/lifters
-CAI
-Port/polish (saw a GREAT how-to on HorsepowerTV one day)
-Let Karla help




Just sayin...that's where I'd start.

 

[RacerXXL]

Define more power? 10HP 30HP 100HP?

 

[ryandavenport]

What about doing one of the 4.5 V8 Infiniti swaps. I know that a lot of guys do that swap in the 240sx. You may talk to Nathan (Mirage) or Jonathan (Xterraforce) or even Michael (noturs14) as they would be a lot of help on this subject. I just honestly don't know what you are going to be able to do as far as the 3.3 goes if you are wanting to make significantly more power. The 350z doesn't have the 3.3 in it. You may also look into doing a VQ35 swap, which would be what was in the later Pathfinders. Those make good power, and since the pathfinder got both the 3.3 and the 3.5 in it's life, it may not be terribly difficult to make work if you can find a donor truck.

 

[drbandkgb]

No supercharges.. No v8s I'm looking to build up a 3.3..


Sent from the satellite of love..

 

[xterror04]

Cams, a bigger bore, and like carla said a port and polish... maybe use s/c injectors if larger... I beleive most of the vg33 blocks are the same. but not all of the other parts will transfer over.. like manifolds etc.. For the bore the best bet would be taking it to a machine shop and seeing what they would say and then see if the pistons are available

 

[xterror04]

I would also look into which motor has higher compression the s/c of non s/c then you could use the higher compression pistons and have the heads shaved down

 

[xterror04]

BOOM!
http://forums.nicoclub.com/true-differences-vg30-vs-vg33-t337554.html

Seeing vg30 cams will work in a vg33 head you can check out www.allthingsz.com they have lots of cam options

And apparently you can run q45 pistons
http://www.motoiq.com/magazine_arti...er-part-10-how-to-build-the-nissan-vg30e.aspx

This build will spend your money lol
http://www.motoiq.com/magazine_arti.../categoryid/80/project-nissan-pathfinder.aspx

 

[TKDx00]

Back in the day, to gain HP and keep the existing block because of the engine mounts, you'd bore out the cylinder walls anywhere up to 30 over(over specs). Use larger pistons, change the lifters, cam shaft, intake and carb. Today w/ 6 cyl, fuel injection and computer controlled everything, it's hard to say.

IMO, a couple of cups of coffee, a Nissan tech and a pad of paper are your best tools for a starting point.

 

[ryandavenport]

Is the drivetrain going to hold up to the additional power that you are planning on producing. We know the Duratracs won't...lol

 

[Mirage]

How much do you want to spend?

Head wise, I'd do the smaller of the JWT cams (or nismo's), a light port and polish of the heads and top it off with headers. Maybe an extrude hone on the intake runners/plenum, but that is pricey, probably not worth the $.

As far as the block goes, you can get .50 mm (.020 in standard speak) oversize pistons from nissan for the VG33, but that is still stock compression (the SC's are lower comp, you don't want those). The Q45 pistons will give you 1.0mm oversize (making it a 3.4l) and bumps the compression up to I think a 9.6:1, they also have a moly or teflon coated skirt, and they are pretty good pistons for an oem. Other than that, balance the entire rotating assembling, give it all a good blue printing (including the oil pump) and just making sure its built right. All of that would net you with a pretty easy, reasonably priced and very reliable motor that gives a nice chunk of power.

You could also do some light crank work like knife edging it to lose some rotating weight and help it cut through the oil vapor in the crankcase, hard to quantify results though.

If you wanted to spend more (and get more) you could do custom pistons, which would be forged and lighter weight, checking the block to see how much you could overbore, you might be able to get more than 1mm out of it, and get a higher compression ratio, like 10:1

I wouldn't deck the heads/block to gain compression, you will mess up the cam timing doing that so you would need adjustable cam gears to get it either back to stock or dial them in for max power.

It really sucks for us not having an off the shelf ecu tuning option, we can't really go too far without taking advantage of the better VE with a better tune. We also have to worry about detonation/knock if we go up to high with the compression ratio and aren't able to optimize the timing maps for it.

 

[xterror04]

Is the drivetrain going to hold up to the additional power that you are planning on producing. We know the Duratracs won't...lol

I wouldn't be worried about the rest of the drivetrain, We already knows that it all handle an extra 40 horsepower from the supercharger, And even after of vg engine is properly build I doubt it makes more than 100 horsepower overstock

 

[NismoFire]

I meant 300ZX...my phone auto corrected to 350z cause I had it programmed in to my word bank.

 

[NMTerras]

How much do you want to spend?

Head wise, I'd do the smaller of the JWT cams (or nismo's), a light port and polish of the heads and top it off with headers. Maybe an extrude hone on the intake runners/plenum, but that is pricey, probably not worth the $.

As far as the block goes, you can get .50 mm (.020 in standard speak) oversize pistons from nissan for the VG33, but that is still stock compression (the SC's are lower comp, you don't want those). The Q45 pistons will give you 1.0mm oversize (making it a 3.4l) and bumps the compression up to I think a 9.6:1, they also have a moly or teflon coated skirt, and they are pretty good pistons for an oem. Other than that, balance the entire rotating assembling, give it all a good blue printing (including the oil pump) and just making sure its built right. All of that would net you with a pretty easy, reasonably priced and very reliable motor that gives a nice chunk of power.

You could also do some light crank work like knife edging it to lose some rotating weight and help it cut through the oil vapor in the crankcase, hard to quantify results though.

If you wanted to spend more (and get more) you could do custom pistons, which would be forged and lighter weight, checking the block to see how much you could overbore, you might be able to get more than 1mm out of it, and get a higher compression ratio, like 10:1

I wouldn't deck the heads/block to gain compression, you will mess up the cam timing doing that so you would need adjustable cam gears to get it either back to stock or dial them in for max power.

It really sucks for us not having an off the shelf ecu tuning option, we can't really go too far without taking advantage of the better VE with a better tune. We also have to worry about detonation/knock if we go up to high with the compression ratio and aren't able to optimize the timing maps for it.

^^^This. Back in the day when I was messing with 240Zs, The fastest one I ever had was the one I had balanced, ported and blueprinted by a competent machine shop (Santa Fe Auto Machine). Every one I ever had benefitted from bumping the compression with a 240 head on a 280 block, but that particular one was noticeably faster than the others. It makes a difference.

 

[SlvrGen1_X]

I think one of the questions you should ask yourself is, what are you primarily going to be using your X for? If just playing around in the mud with the ocaissional hard obstacles or just more crawling. If you crawlings your choice, I would look at ways to create more torque so you can crawl easier in lower gear. I know I have been looking at finding ways to create more low end torque as well as mid range power for the highway. I think that is better choice. There arent many options out there for us and being there there are only a few vehicles with the 3.3 it makes it even harder. The nice thing about nissans is that the same series of motors have a lot of interchangeable parts. there are some of the Z31 300ZX VG 30 parts that will work with the VG33. If you look at the old L-Series Datsun motors almost all of the parts are interchangeable if the research is done properly. Im not saying to go out and do this but you can take 4-cylinder and 6 cylinder parts and intermix them to create your own perfect stroker kit. Again that is a seperate motor and vehicle so before you do any of that make sure you do your research check piston size to bore size and pin size of the rods. There are plenty of kits out there to do an overbore with the factory style pistons that only costs around 650 bucks. When doing this I would strongly suggest having both the engine block and cylinder heads hot tanked to get rid of all of the old rust caused byt water and clean out the oil journals to free the flow again. As someone mentioned above porting and polishing is important and making sure the the gasket match the port they are mating to. This little extra effort can free up some valuable horsepower. Can always look at porting and polishing the intake manifold as well. every little bit helps. One thing with injectors is that you can usually take them to a carb shop and have them bore them out to the supercheged versions specs or if you want larger than that. But Ill warn you when you do this that your engine will run very rich unless you have a proper adjustable fuel pressure regulator and proper tune on your computer.

 

[SlvrGen1_X]

Not trying to sound like Im questioning this but I think that the VG33 came in frontiers, xterras, quests and 2nd gen pathfinders. The older maximas, 300Z/ZX (Z31 & Z32), and hardbodies had a VG30, both engines in SOHC and the later VG30 being offered in DOHC as well as Turbo and TwinTurbo model. After that they stepped up to a new designed called the VQ series motor with DOHC and offered in many sizes from 3.0, 3.5, 3.7 and 4.0. these were offered in VQ30 - Maxima & I30. VQ35 - Maxima, pathfinder, altima, quest, murano, I35, G35, FX35, 350Z, M35, & QX4. VQ37 - G37, FX37, EX37, 370Z, M37. and the VQ40 - Xterra, Frontier, and Pathfinder. I only know this because I used to play with S13 and S14's (240SX) all of the time and every one of these motors fits in the car. I wanted to see what would work best and what is interchangeable.

 

[drbandkgb]

The goal is more power.. This is about to be a toy.. Im still looking into all of this but... The goal right now is to piece the SAS together then motor work.. Im still looking for a block to work from.. I have no time frame on this.. Im really looking to find a deal on the engine. When I SAS the rig It will be geared right so Im not wasting the HPs

 

[yellowbug]

I looked into a frankenstein vg motor sometime ago when I wanted to rebuild and this is the best and most informational reading I got. If this had already been posted sorry for the double.

http://www.motoiq.com/magazine_arti...er-part-10-how-to-build-the-nissan-vg30e.aspx

 

[Bluedog]

I did a couple of VG30's from '93 Pathfinders installing cams, headers and an ECU reprogram. There was a noticable difference in the performance of the vehicle but nothing spectacular. I guess the comparison would be like driving a stock 2002 and then driving a 2005 Xterra. The bottom ends of the VG motor is a very sturdy platform to build off of. I would find a VG30 turbo engine to work from, electronics and harness. There is a guy in Colorado that is building a twin turbo version of his VG30 for his Pathfinder.

 

[Cyclemut]

Hmmm..... the guy in Colorado you say?



That would be Ryan (GrandpaX), my business partner. Plans keep changing a little here and there and he took time off to build the Boulder Nissan truck, but his Pathy is coming along.

I would look at the Q45 piston idea (Ryan also has everything to do that build as well, I think he has ADHD or something) with some reground cams, balanced rotating assembly, blueprinted (Which is very time consuming, but extremely rewarding. I'm planning on taking at least a week to blueprint my bug motor, and it's only a 4 cylinder air cooled engine the size of a large suitcase.) and gasket matched.

You can turn some bigger numbers out of it. Have the power of a 2nd Gen. It's only time and money.

 

[ChiXterra]

Hey Dave.... Roninjiro is selling his motor..

 

[drbandkgb]

Yeah but it's a hair high for my taste.. I feel like this motor idea may be pushed ahead of the SAS. Stan had a nasty rear main leak and with 214k miles on it.. It's due for some love..

Question..
If I found a 2002-2004 motor would that work? I know they have slightly more hp. Is there any wire harness issues or changes? Vs 2000 I have now.

 

[Cyclemut]

Yes, the newer engines will work. Most of the tune was in the computer for the slightly more horsepower, along with the advertising antics of big corporations.

 

[drbandkgb]

So.. Sounds like Id need to rob a computer to make that work.. Blaaa...
Ill find me a engine soon

 

[Cyclemut]

No, sorry, I wasn't clear on that.

Your computer is just fine, that engine will work for you without any issues at all. There was only some slight tweeking of the newer fuel maps that had to do with the EGR systems and whatnot that ended up making a couple of more ponies.

Everything else is exactly the same! Connectors, locations, gaskets, pistons, etc. are all exactly the same. You won't have any issues at all Dave.

 

[ChiXterra]

Yeah but it's a hair high for my taste.. I feel like this motor idea may be pushed ahead of the SAS. Stan had a nasty rear main leak and with 214k miles on it.. It's due for some love..

Question..
If I found a 2002-2004 motor would that work? I know they have slightly more hp. Is there any wire harness issues or changes? Vs 2000 I have now.

Oh nooooo!!

 

[drbandkgb]

Oh nooooo!!

I know.. I have a rear main issue.. The p505 issue.. Cracked mani issue.. Valve cover gasket driver side is shot.. The poor little motor is in need of some loving badly. Oh and the timing belt is just about due.. Never know though.. I need to take the top of and fix the code and while it's off I'm going to do the KS and new intake mod. So I'm looking at min 300 with just that small fix.. I do keep my eyes out for axels
Dave is in need of one hell of a mod day soon

 

[ChiXterra]

I know.. I have a rear main issue.. The p505 issue.. Cracked mani issue.. Valve cover gasket driver side is shot.. The poor little motor is in need of some loving badly. Oh and the timing belt is just about due.. Never know though.. I need to take the top of and fix the code and while it's off I'm going to do the KS and new intake mod. So I'm looking at min 300 with just that small fix.. I do keep my eyes out for axels
Dave is in need of one hell of a mod day soon

Man, that is a laundry list of stuff to fix!:zomg:

 

[NismoFire]

I know.. I have a rear main issue.. The p505 issue.. Cracked mani issue.. Valve cover gasket driver side is shot.. The poor little motor is in need of some loving badly. Oh and the timing belt is just about due.. Never know though.. I need to take the top of and fix the code and while it's off I'm going to do the KS and new intake mod. So I'm looking at min 300 with just that small fix.. I do keep my eyes out for axels
Dave is in need of one hell of a mod day soon

Summer Tune Up at Dave's house? Count me in. I want to swap plugs/wires and HOPEFULLY intake spacer.

 

[Cyclemut]

Why would you want an intake spacer?

 

[NismoFire]

Try to make up for some of the lost power from the MTs. Fuel mileage, etc.

 

[Cyclemut]

If you're expecting power from a throttle body spacer, or even a phonelic unit, you'll hate it for the money.

If you want power, lose some lift, inflate the tires up a bit and drive with less throttle. You'll get more that way than you will with a spacer.

I drive easy on my throttle and am getting 20.8mpg, with a small lift. I don't expect more than a couple of mpg's after my SAS with 33's and gears. It's about how you drive, not what you drive.

And check your engine's tune. Tweaking here and there, making sure everything is great, not just OK, will also get you more mpg's than a spacer.

Hell, I got 39mpg's out of my '66 Beetle with dual carbs, low gears and the windows down constantly on a regular basis. Most everyone else get's in the high 20's with the same setup. I just drive differently.

 

[ChiXterra]

If you're expecting power from a throttle body spacer, or even a phonelic unit, you'll hate it for the money.

If you want power, lose some lift, inflate the tires up a bit and drive with less throttle. You'll get more that way than you will with a spacer.

I drive easy on my throttle and am getting 20.8mpg, with a small lift. I don't expect more than a couple of mpg's after my SAS with 33's and gears. It's about how you drive, not what you drive.

And check your engine's tune. Tweaking here and there, making sure everything is great, not just OK, will also get you more mpg's than a spacer.

Hell, I got 39mpg's out of my '66 Beetle with dual carbs, low gears and the windows down constantly on a regular basis. Most everyone else get's in the high 20's with the same setup. I just drive differently.

Really?

 

[Cyclemut]

Yep, I expect upwards of 18, maybe even 17, but nothing less.

 

[NMTerras]

Hmmm..... the guy in Colorado you say?



That would be Ryan (GrandpaX), my business partner. Plans keep changing a little here and there and he took time off to build the Boulder Nissan truck, but his Pathy is coming along.

I would look at the Q45 piston idea (Ryan also has everything to do that build as well, I think he has ADHD or something) with some reground cams, balanced rotating assembly, blueprinted (Which is very time consuming, but extremely rewarding. I'm planning on taking at least a week to blueprint my bug motor, and it's only a 4 cylinder air cooled engine the size of a large suitcase.) and gasket matched.

You can turn some bigger numbers out of it. Have the power of a 2nd Gen. It's only time and money.

Go on...I'm listening...

 

[TKDx00]

If you're expecting power from a throttle body spacer, or even a phonelic unit, you'll hate it for the money.

If you want power, lose some lift, inflate the tires up a bit and drive with less throttle. You'll get more that way than you will with a spacer.

I drive easy on my throttle and am getting 20.8mpg, with a small lift. I don't expect more than a couple of mpg's after my SAS with 33's and gears. It's about how you drive, not what you drive.

And check your engine's tune. Tweaking here and there, making sure everything is great, not just OK, will also get you more mpg's than a spacer.

Hell, I got 39mpg's out of my '66 Beetle with dual carbs, low gears and the windows down constantly on a regular basis. Most everyone else get's in the high 20's with the same setup. I just drive differently.

Would you explain these a little further please? Lose or just smaller BL's and SL's? What kind of tweaking? I don't have 33's nor a BL and they aren't in my plans. 32's and 3" SL was as far as I planned to go.

 

[xterror04]

The Intake spacer for the first gens is only $75 i dont feel like I got ripped off, It gave me a decent amount of midrange power, nothing quite like ditching the cats, but it was noticable, I can squeeze 18mpg out of my truck

 

[ChiXterra]

Yep, I expect upwards of 18, maybe even 17, but nothing less.

Very interesting. I guess I should be a little more optimistic with my SAS build. I've been at 16mpg city of late, so maybe it won't be so bad.

 

[NismoFire]

How are you people getting this mileage??? I'm stuck at 13.8 with 32s...........??????

 

[ChiXterra]

How are you people getting this mileage??? I'm stuck at 13.8 with 32s...........??????

Its about how you drive.