PhullD's Build Thread

[General_Tarfun]

Sounds about right. I ended up putting mine back on a few years ago but fabricated a new mounting bracket for it with 2" (I think) square steel bar. It's in my build thread somewhere. I forget the exact dimensions but I moved it back the 2" and up the amount of my lift so around 4". Basically measured it to see how high it needed to be for the bar to sit flat the way it's supposed to, after that the stability was much improved over before. I know the lean you're talking about and it got rid of most of it.

 

[PhullD]

Sounds about right. I ended up putting mine back on a few years ago but fabricated a new mounting bracket for it with 2" (I think) square steel bar. It's in my build thread somewhere. I forget the exact dimensions but I moved it back the 2" and up the amount of my lift so around 4". Basically measured it to see how high it needed to be for the bar to sit flat the way it's supposed to, after that the stability was much improved over before. I know the lean you're talking about and it got rid of most of it.

This is my hope, and a bonus is the truck won't have a lazy rear on the road. Guess I found out how much lift is too much lift in the rear lol! Did you watch the video? It contradicts everything I've been told but my off-road experience seems to confirm this also applies to the Xterra platform.

 

[General_Tarfun]

Yeah it's hard to argue with what they show in that video but I'm with you, my experience has been similar. I guess it make sense when I think about it, the rear has a ton more travel than the front so if you can use the rear to help the front make better contact you're not losing much. I hope you can track down a swaybar, I'm interested to know what your experience will be since it will be X specific.

 

[Brunnie]

Looks like I need to put mine back on, especially since I'm now towing a camper.

 

[IM1RU]

Looks like I need to put mine back on, especially since I'm now towing a camper.

Meh. I tow all the time. That said my springs are rated for the full load of the rig plus the tongue weight of the trailer. Rig rides a bit stiff on the road when unloaded, but doesn't squat at all fully loaded. I don't mind the body roll.

 

[PhullD]

Looks like I need to put mine back on, especially since I'm now towing a camper

If you want a bit more stability I would try Hellwig helper springs before putting the sway bar back on, they are very easy to install and not very much money. The issues I'm dealing with only really apply offroad and at the more extreme end of modification.

I won't however recommend towing without one, logic dictates it is safer with one.

 

[PhullD]

"my springs are rated for the full load of the rig plus the tongue weight of the trailer"

Same here, and yes a bit stiff when empty, particularly at low speeds, rides nice at higher speeds.

 

[PhullD]

I hope you can track down a swaybar, I'm interested to know what your experience will be since it will be X specific.

I have a couple in the works, everyone is saying "I got one, just have to find it" lol! I will probably need to make extensions for the rear axle and buy longer end links from another application, ideally adjustable end links. I will definitely make it a how-to with parts and pics if it works out.

 

[Brunnie]

If you want a bit more stability I would try Hellwig helper springs before putting the sway bar back on, they are very easy to install and not very much money. The issues I'm dealing with only really apply offroad and at the more extreme end of modification.

I won't however recommend towing without one, logic dictates it is safer with one.

I'll see how it all handles, and if I think I need it I'll put the swaybar back on. Got a weight distrubiting hitch with sway control as the trailer is 3800 lbs, and I just want to be as safe as possible. It has been a long time since I've towed an RV, and the previous tow vehicle was '84 F250 4x4 Supercab, with 460 engine. A real stump puller.

 

[TerryD]

Still no replies for a rear sway bar. With the shear number of people I know that have removed the rear you would think more would be lying around! I threw mine out in 2016 (was living in a condo) lol

Anyway saw this video and it got me thinking.

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gcgKbUTQJy8


I will start by stating I have 650 lb springs on radflo coilovers up front right now and Alcans in the rear. The front behaves amazing on-road, no need for a sway bar, but the back likes to lean all the time. I can live with that, but I've kind of been disappointed with how the front of my Xterra behaves off-road.

I thought maybe the 650's were too much, maybe they have too much preload (adjusted for lift) but I don't think that's it because the coliover collar is adjusted up only 1/2". I thought of running the coilovers at the lowest setting but in reality I think the problem is the rear. It articulates so much and so freely the front just goes with it, resulting in excess drama up front, and NO articulation and a tire lifting on occasion where it shouldn't. Especially on uphill obstacles. The worst incident resulting in the truck full on leaning when on a banked obstacle and just sliding down once the rear got involved, whereas had it been controlled and the front articulated it would have been nothing. I love the articulation the Alcans provide, but seems like it is now detrimental, and if that video has any truth to it, I think it is worthwhile to experiment with the possibility of re-implementing a sway bar back there.

Thoughts?

My Avatar pick was with different springs and the stock leaf springs, an AAL and Hellwig helpers maxed out. The Hellwigs kind of kept the rear from just drooping so easily and the front would eat bumps articulating nicely because of it, I really miss that feeling.

That's a pretty interesting video.

I found with my XJ that the bastard packs I built with an XJ main leaf and S-10 packs didn't force the front to travel nearly as much as the heavy load OME packs that were on it when I sold it.

Spring rates are very important here. A sway-bar is meant to allow you to run lower rate springs on each corner for improved ride while still maintaining cornering stability of a heavier dynamic rate (spring + swaybar vs just spring).

What allows us to get away with running no sway bars is the much higher spring rates most of us run for the added weight. It makes each corner carry more load in the curves. I'm not sure how much his kits increase the spring rates on each corner of his truck, so you may or may not see similar results because of that.

Coil sprung rear suspensions also tend to be flexier than leaf sprung, which was one reason I prefer the Xterra for a dual purpose rig over a 4Runner, so that might affect it to.

You'll have to set up some tests like he did and take good notes. I'm interested in seeing what you find out.

 

[TerryD]

I have a couple in the works, everyone is saying "I got one, just have to find it" lol! I will probably need to make extensions for the rear axle and buy longer end links from another application, ideally adjustable end links. I will definitely make it a how-to with parts and pics if it works out.

I would buy heims and build my own so you can fine tune everything. You can get high-misalignment spacers for most heims and be able to adjust it. I would also consider putting custom sway-bar mounts on the axle to mount it higher and get rid of the original, low hanging mounts if your tests show good results.

 

[PhullD]

I would buy heims and build my own so you can fine tune everything. You can get high-misalignment spacers for most heims and be able to adjust it. I would also consider putting custom sway-bar mounts on the axle to mount it higher and get rid of the original, low hanging mounts if your tests show good results.

I don't know about heims, but for sure adjustables will be the focus. Heims don't last long here, it is humid and if you drive in the winter, the salt will mess those up (mine is retired from winter driving). Our end links are like 9" stock so that is out of the question. If my only option is heims, I'll take it though.

As you say the brackets on the axle are kind of low, I would like to move them up, depends how the sway bar lines up with the way I've modified the Xterra and if my second gas tank is an issue. I will post up when I get a sway bar and begin the documenting like I did with the gas tank mod as I go along. My hope is to have it done by the Fall and begin testing, if successful I'll make a couple kits for others to try out.

 

[TerryD]

I don't know about heims, but for sure adjustables will be the focus. Heims don't last long here, it is humid and if you drive in the winter, the salt will mess those up (mine is retired from winter driving). Our end links are like 9" stock so that is out of the question. If my only option is heims, I'll take it though.

As you say the brackets on the axle are kind of low, I would like to move them up, depends how the sway bar lines up with the way I've modified the Xterra and if my second gas tank is an issue. I will post up when I get a sway bar and begin the documenting like I did with the gas tank mod as I go along. My hope is to have it done by the Fall and begin testing, if successful I'll make a couple kits for others to try out.

You might look into ATV TREs on eBay. Maybe mid 90's Kawasaki Bayou 220 TREs.

 

[TerryD]

I remembered I had played with my ramps, checking out my travel and bump stops. You can see that my body is pretty level in this so before you get too carried away, you might want to do some testing and just see where you're at.

 

[PhullD]

Update:

Been a while, with the majority of my weekends absorbed in cutting and processing trees after this past winter, I barely had time to do anything until August. I am also currently between jobs so I haven't spent much time on the Xterra or the trailer even though the yard is finally done. Just had my 2nd interview for a new job, really hoping I get the job because although I have offers for other jobs they will require 2.5hrs of driving every day. This new job is 12 min from my house!

Anyway I'm thinking of selling the Alcans I have currently (+ 800lbs and 3" lift) and re-ordering some lighter duty springs since I no longer load up the Xterra as I once did. I was thinking of dropping down to +400lbs over stock and 4" lift. I was also contemplating the orbit eyes this time.

1. Current poly bushings get chewed up, I will be on my 3rd set if I replace it this year or next (they are almost due)
2. The poly squeaks. I had grease fittings installed on the rear eyelets (that bolt into the shackles) and that has been a real plus, but the front eyelets have to be dropped again for a re-grease
3. I don't daily the Xterra and it doesn't see winter. It parks inside a garage 99% of the time. Also I have a dewalt grease gun so maintenance is not really a problem when it comes to greasing the orbit eyes.

If someone has an opinion I would like to hear it. I don't care about the additional articulation, but to be completely free of the poly bushings seems appealing to me right now.

Yes I am still planning on retro-fitting a sway bar, but I have decided the trailer will take priority.
Also will be replacing the front lower control arms with OEM Titan ones, likely next season. There is a bit of play in the current ones. I would like to weld some tabs for limit straps on the new set.

My regional club's annual offroad event is next weekend, I will hopefully have some photo's/videos to show afterwards.

 

[PhullD]

My clubs' event on Labour Day weekend.

 

[PhullD]

Here are a couple short video clips too.

https://imgur.com/zBZILaV

View: https://i.imgur.com/zBZILaV.mp4

https://imgur.com/ht2GNYg

View: https://i.imgur.com/ht2GNYg.mp4

https://imgur.com/ECpjy94

View: https://i.imgur.com/ECpjy94.mp4

 

[PhullD]

Ordered a bunch of stuff. New Alcans for lighter duty (+200lbs instead of +800lbs) and better ride quality seeing as I carry 500lbs+ less weight around now.

Z1 performance sells greasable pins for the front eyelets, also got some greasable shackles and new shackle bushings, 1" adapter to solve the tire rub on the upper control arms, and OEM titan lowers to replace the Moog crap that is already getting tired (ball joint and bushings have some play).

Got the top dia.ond plate to finish the trailer....gonna be a busy spring!

 

[Prime]

Glad to hear from you! Glad you're still keeping the faith.

OEM lowers for all things. In fact, OE parts wherever you can. Turns out Nissan knows how to engineer shiat.

 

[PhullD]

I have a Nisstec u-bolt flip kit on my Alcans right now and I am trying to measure for u-bolt replacements. I know they are semi round, 9/16 at the threads, 8-9" in length but the inner distance between the legs is what I want to double check. I measured 2 1/2". Can anyone double check that?